Comments on: REBOOT: East Side Rail Tunnel (Part I)

By: Miguel

Miguel — Tue, 09 Mar 2010 20:06:58 +0000

The only problem with this plan is that no one wants to go to Fall River or New Bedford. They are dead end cities between Providence and Spain. And now that the Iway is built, I doubt money will be spent on this tunnel.

I think a better idea is a bridge south of I-195, connecting Conimicut with Bristol. This will avoid having to drive through Providence to get to points east.

By: Matthew Coolidge

Matthew Coolidge — Tue, 13 Jan 2009 13:48:24 +0000

Previously, someone asked where the east end of the tunnel was. Here is the google map of the location. You can see it exits just east of the intersection of Gano and Amy streets.
View Larger Map

By: Jef Nickerson

Jef Nickerson — Mon, 12 Jan 2009 16:21:35 +0000

Andrew,
I know the kind of system you are talking about. Proof-of-payment is much more common in Europe, though there are some systems in the US (especially newer systems) which use it. The RiverLine in NJ uses it.

I was last in SF more than 10 years ago, back then they did not use a P-o-p system (not sure what they do now, but I assume it hasn’t changed). I found SF to be very confusing. They have several different transit systems, MUNI, BART, and CalTrain in the city and some other systems in other communities such as San Jose. Each system runs it’s own fare collection, though there are provisions to buy multi cards (i.e. fare cards that will work both on MUNI and BART). I bought my first fare at a station near the Airport (BART didn’t reach the airport yet when I was there). And I bought a multi card but ended up getting way more than I needed because the fare machine confounded me.

Boarding the MUNI trolleys you had to pay the fare at the entrance to the train, just like Boston.

I agree that if/when we have trolleys a Proof-of-payment system would be ideal, since many of our trains would be running in the street.

By: Andrew

Andrew — Sun, 11 Jan 2009 23:10:20 +0000

Corey,
In the system I am talking about, there are no turnstiles, and no line to swipe or pay as you enter a bus. But you must be ready to show a pass or stamped ticket while you are riding. Tickets are sold at vending machines and in stores. There are time stamp machines near the doors of the buses so you can stamp your ticket yourself and then you have 2 hours to ride around, transfers and all.
So. in SF do you line up to pay the $1.50 as you enter the bus or trolley or are there change machines at the stops? And if you have a valid ticket and you are transferring, does the driver have to examine it or can you just hop on?

By: Corey

Corey — Sun, 11 Jan 2009 19:48:35 +0000

Andrew – I’m not exactly sure what your question is. There is some sort of proof of payment involved, but it’s done in sort of a loose way because the point of the system is to make the intermodal aspect of the city’s transit run as smoothly as possible. San Francisco probably has more transit options packed into one city than anywhere else in the country: Bus, Subway (Muni, BART and Caltrain), Streetcar, Trackless Trolley, and Cablecar. It almost always requires more than one mode of transportation to get where you need to go, so the transfer vouchers are designed to let that happen without holding up the works at every stop. It seems to work very well for them, although I did have one qualm:

You have to pay the fare ($1.50) in coins, but the change machines only dispense dollar coins. You overpay by 50 cents half the time if you’re not completely anal about hoarding quarters.

By: Andrew

Andrew — Sun, 11 Jan 2009 15:14:51 +0000

Does SF do “Proof of Payment” or honor system fare collection? That River Line mentioned above does. It makes a lot of sense. When it seems to take forever for people to get off and on the bus, I get this message: Better that all you slobs have your ride take twice as long than have one of you sneak on for free. No wonder there are still so many people who will not consider using the bus.

If all you need to ride is a pass or self-validated ticket, buses or streetcars can have several large doors so people can hop off and on quickly. The savings from cheap equipment and tickets instead of high-maintenance electronic fare apparatus go into spot check enforcement of proof of payment. Those ever moving officers provide better security and customer service for passengers. Drivers can focus solely on driving.

By: Corey

Corey — Sat, 10 Jan 2009 22:02:42 +0000

San Francisco also has a system with free transfers. You pay the toll when you board, and a little voucher prints out with a time on it. All your rides are free until the time printed on the voucher expires.

By: Alex B

Alex B — Sat, 10 Jan 2009 05:33:35 +0000

I really like Corey’s idea. I would like to see this light rail system also extend from Pawtucket to Cranston to serve the immediate metro while being sure to make use of the Broad Street Corridor (stopping at Roger Williams Park, of course), which is among RIPTA’s busiest lines if I’m not mistaken. That’ll provide more tranist options for that area. Buses and light rail – horay! Montreal has a great system using free transfers between rail and bus. I think it works well.

By: mental757

mental757 — Thu, 08 Jan 2009 17:04:50 +0000

As far as the street car lines, I’d begin with the busiest (within the city) RIPTA lines (maybe the trolley lines?). On-street parking along the routes that are chosen will also need to be reduced or eliminated to allow for better flow of cars (in motion) and the street-cars. This could also promote 2 things: parking lots might become garages and less parking = more reason to use transit. I think one of the first basic lines needs to link KP and Providence Station to allow for better intermodal connection throughout the entire system.

Hope you feel better Jef…

By: Jef Nickerson

Jef Nickerson — Thu, 08 Jan 2009 15:24:40 +0000

I’ve been ill so I haven’t been able to keep up with the comments here. I’m reading through them now and will be incorporating some into the next REBOOT.